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Advanced AI shenanigans

Discussion in 'Tips & Tricks' started by Vikingkid3, Jun 22, 2017.

  1. Vikingkid3

    Vikingkid3 New Member

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    I'll preface this saying that I have a team of baby fighters. Strongest is a 1600 fs Epic Sax. Perhaps that is the reason that the advanced AI can be so difficult to beat (by advanced ai I mean the prize fight ai after a win streak of 8 or 9), since I can't one combo every fighter. So is there anyway to actually duplicate the kind of fighting that the advanced ai uses?

    I have never been able to get past a 10 steak, because around that time it seems like the game just decides that it won't let me advance any further. For example, I'll start doing a combo, finish the taps, launch them into the air, start the air combo, then they will, while in the air, use their blockbuster against me and kill my fighter (by a 10 streak I'm usually fighting people 2-3x my fs that deal instakill damage if the BB is unblocked).

    The above scenario, and similar scenarios (tagging out while being tap combo'd or in the air, instant blocking and counter attacks, etc.), happen everytime I get a high streak. I even had one fight where the opponent interrupted Parasols combo BB (the one where she puts her umbrella up the person's butt), while in the air, to use their own BB, which actually broke the fight since the opponent was no longer on screen and parasol was doing some marry poppins stuff on the ground and uncontrollable. Ended up losing that fight to the timer.

    So are the some advanced tactics that allow you to use abilities, or attack/block, faster than normal, or does the game just turn on hacks in an attempt to make the enemies more difficult (or impossible) to defeat?

    Thanks for your assistance.
     
  2. FelixDewott

    FelixDewott New Member

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    As someone that has reached a nine-win streak himself, I will say that as you get a higher win streak in Prize Fights, enemy team scores get higher and higher. It also doesn't help that the three enemy teams you can choose are randomized based on your team's score and the enemies get stronger as you climb the win streak ladder.

    I do have a few tips in mind, but just so you know, there will be a point where enemy AI just becomes too stubborn, even when against an easy team.

    First, try to upgrade your moves. Moves that are equipped to fighters can increase stats based on move tier and level, but they don't artificially raise or lower FS. If you're using bronze moves, I recommend trying to upgrade them to silver moves that have the stat boosts you want. Gold and Silver moves are naturally stronger than bronze ones (this also applies to BBs) and after upgrading one enough, it will become even stronger. Just make sure you're equipping the right moves that have the stats you want.

    Next, make sure you look at the tier modifier. Silver and Bronze tier matches have different modifiers that affect both sides and there's only a single modifier in both tiers. So if you have fighters and/or moves that you can exploit the modifiers with, consider using those as long as they are allowed into that tier.

    Finally, try to avoid using weaker, multi-hit characters like Painwheel, Filia, or Valentine and favor using heavy hitters such as Cerebella and Peacock. Some heavy hitters like Big Band are also multi-hit characters and due to Prize Fights requiring four energy per fight, you'll need to change teams often if you don't want to spend Theonite to recharge cards. Make sure you don't neglect the Skill Trees of each card and buy upgrades when you can (especially on Signature Abilities), and change up moves on cards when you can to better prepare stat-wise for certain situations.

    With all this said, there's one thing to keep in mind: You are NEVER guaranteed to win a match in Prize Fights. Due to the RNG nature of the three teams to choose from and no option for a re-roll, there will always be a point where winning is impossible. If you have a big win streak, try fighting Aeon or Venus teams when you can as those are randomly generated AI teams. Other than that, try changing your tactics in-game if something's not working out. The smallest change can make a huge difference, so feel free to experiment if you're having trouble and just bring your A-game.
     
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  3. Vikingkid3

    Vikingkid3 New Member

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    I appreciate your response and advice, Felix. However, the issue isn't the strength of the enemy team, or necessarily the weakness of mine. I have no problem with the enemy team being strong enough to defeat my fighters in single combos. The issue is that they can execute those combos at times when they shouldn't be able to, for instance while being in the air from one of my combos.
     
  4. FelixDewott

    FelixDewott New Member

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    In the air? Huh. I've never actually encountered this.
    In this case, it could be possible that you're running into something that shouldn't be happening. You can't even Burst when in the air as far as I know so if an AI enemy can interrupt an aerial combo, you might want to see if this is a bug you're running into.
     
  5. Poringsmasher

    Poringsmasher Member

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    I wouldn't say any character is "weak" and I wouldn't discourage people from trying out everyone. Painwheel is a risk reward type with very high attack and low hp/def so one decent opening can often 1 combo KO. Filia can also be quite good and most versions of her focus on crit in some way. Valentine is perhaps the weakest but some versions of her have some cool builds you can work around to do some interesting things.

    My power gold PF team consists of Parasoul, Filia, and Painwheel but these days I usually use each one separately to carry lowbie and still kill whole teams with just each one by themselves. I often lose my 20something streak (never really bothered to check) fighting a team where all 3 are over twice the FP of the highest in my team and I die to a bunch of BB3s. Obviously if I only fought with my 3 best I probably wouldn't lose my streak but I also wouldn't get as many characters leveled and wouldn't generate points nearly as fast.

    Basically, don't be afraid to experiment with different characters. See what their special ability is and build around that. If you can, put another character or two that'll compliment that also.
     
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  6. FelixDewott

    FelixDewott New Member

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    I'm not calling any character weak. I stand by the theory that any character can win in any match-up, but if it's true that he's being interrupted through an aerial combo, there might be something more going on here.

    And just to clarify, my main team has a Graveyard Shift Valentine in it, possibly my best Valentine card despite being a silver and I also have Parasite Weave Filia who's almost the strongest card I own in terms of FS alone. Again, Any card can win any match-up. That's what I believe, at least.
     
  7. Poringsmasher

    Poringsmasher Member

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    Ah nice, Graveyard Shift I literally just gold ranked today even though I already have Silent Kill because GS is one of the best Valentines. Parasite Weave is also a fun crit stunner besides the fact that Filia as a character is also very mobile which is also sometimes quite helpful for dashing in or out.

    As far as the getting hit in the air goes as much as I've played I've never seen that happen so I'm at a loss there. The only thing I can think of is sometimes if you're a tad too far when launching sometimes they can slip out of the air combo, but I've never seen them hit back at that point. Aside from that there aren't any BBs that can be done while in the air so I'm extra confused.
     
  8. Vikingkid3

    Vikingkid3 New Member

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    I'm gonna have to find a way to record the matches, because it happens to me frequently. 3 times today alone. The ai is always hitting me with some real wonky stuff once I get up to a 9+ streak.
     
  9. Poringsmasher

    Poringsmasher Member

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    I get higher win steaks than that and never have the AI do anything markedly different. The only difference is higher ones tend to have better movesets so they have more options for chaining.

    Which characters are you using when this happens to you? Is it vs the same character or any of them? Or for that matter, what is the exact string of hits that you do and when/what the AI does. Just trying to get a better idea of what might be happening if there's some glitch or something.
     
  10. tom641

    tom641 Active Member

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    I don't think the AI ever blatantly cheats (other than things like "there's one frame where you could act that you silly fleshy humans can't actually make use of lol") but it really does feel like the game sometimes just tells you to go die in a fire.

    The most blatant example i've ever had is a Valentine with unblockable charge attacks hit me, did the ground combo to hit me with the last two hits of it, and charged another charge attack as I was still getting up, rinse and repeat. Granted that was a treasure node in "Going All In" Expert, so I imagine I won't experience that until I fight maxed out golds in prize fights, if I ever get to that point.
     
  11. FelixDewott

    FelixDewott New Member

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    Actually, come to think of it, the AI can sometimes act cheaply. Spamming throws is an example I have. Some Valentine enemies can't stop spamming the grabs, even while I'm still getting up. Of course, their throws can be broken and punished, especially with Cerebella's Balancing Act, but sometimes cocky AI can also have a reason to be such and break your face in another way.
     
  12. tom641

    tom641 Active Member

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    Well, SOMETIMES you can break Valentine's throws. If you're reacting to the throw visually it may already be too late.
     
  13. Vikingkid3

    Vikingkid3 New Member

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    I have not noticed any pattern (as far as which fighters i'm using or fighting, or which move they are using) when my aerial attacks are interrupted. The 3 that happened today were all on the 10th fight, first was my Filia vs a Valentine that used EKG Flatliner during my aerial, 2nd was my Painwheel getting beat down by a Filia that did not use a BB but started using a tap combo during my aerial, 3rd was my Cerebella vs another Cerebella that used the Diamonds Are Forever BB during my aerial combo.

    Interestingly enough, once I got home and downloaded a program to record the fights, the first 9+ streak I got into did not end with any weird shenanigans. Still need to keep trying to confirm but perhaps it has something to do with lag or a poor internet connection while not at home. I would assume that the fights are all client based, but perhaps they are not.
     
  14. Poringsmasher

    Poringsmasher Member

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    I think where I'm getting confused is your use of "aerial combo" which can only be done after you launch the opponent into the air and you continue attacking. Even if you didn't tap the screen after launching they can't attack you back, so I'm not sure what you mean.

    Now, the AI CAN get some frame perfect attacks in in certain situations but that has nothing to do with "AI shenanigans" as if we were able to perfectly time it we could do it too. Even on 20+ win streaks the AI does the same stuff it always does. In any case this only happens on the ground. I've never encountered any lag but that's the only thing I can think of being the cause unless you mean something different from what I think you mean.
     
  15. Vikingkid3

    Vikingkid3 New Member

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    Poring, that's exactly what I mean with the aerial combo. I swipe up, they are in the air, I tap and start doing the, normally uninterruptible, aerial combo. It is at that point that the the above scenarios took place. My guess, since I haven't been able to replicate it on a stable internet connection, is that somehow there is lag and that my client is showing me start the aerial combo, but the game servers didn't receive that information in time. And the AIs frame perfect timing executed a BB before the server received my air attack signal. But there is no reason for thIs type of game to not be client based.
     
  16. luawei

    luawei Member

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    I've actually noticed the AI using Blockbusters in the middle of being hit in an aerial combo. I only ever see this with Peacock when I launch an enemy after using a George's Day Out bomb. It doesn't always happen but it is definitely really wonky and probably shouldn't be happening. Another wonky thing is sometimes Throw Techs causes both characters to move into each other instead of away. I seem to notice this the most against Filia and it's quite troubling since they'll continue to attempt throws or hit me before I react.

    That aside, really I can only recommend you to continue to level up and unlock your character skill tree. Epic Sax is especially powerful because of his passive that gives bonus damage on long combos. Also try to utilize Cymbal Clash (for stun) and Beat Extend (for multi-hit and an easy Cymbal Clash afterwards) in your arsenal. I've been able to annihilate 25k Fighter Score teams with a single 3k Epic Sax. Just keep blocking, punish them once they finish their combo and watch out for throws.
     
    #16 luawei, Jun 23, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2017
  17. meta

    meta Member

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    Advanced AI is too dumb. He have zero frame recoveries after throws, charge attacks, BB and even full blocked combos. They even have zero recovery and keep you in stun block doing full combos without any time to punish them.
    And as was mentioned, they fall out of combos out of know where and they can do a BB and special moves mid combos.
     
  18. ThanatosDK

    ThanatosDK Active Member

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    This is what makes characters like Big Top Cerebela and Untouchable Peacock so dangerous. They get Super Armor passively then immediately punish.
     
  19. meta

    meta Member

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    Another thing, how can the AI tag in and out while they are being comboed? Even before launched?
    AI needs fixing.
     
  20. Poringsmasher

    Poringsmasher Member

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    I think some of you are just lagging and/or are using an older phone. A lot of the things mentioned in this thread are things that don't normally happen
     

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