1. [2018/06/22]
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Fights Possible Unflinching Change?

Discussion in 'Feedback & Suggestions' started by Goatman302, Nov 15, 2018.

?

Unflinching Fix:

  1. It's fine as is

    85.0%
  2. Reduce time of buff

    5.0%
  3. Reduce armor to one or two hits

    5.0%
  4. Get rid of altogether

    5.0%
  1. Goatman302

    Goatman302 New Member

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    Alright after losing 15+ Streaks over and over again to Unflinching via Untouchable and Armed Forces, I feel I have to speak up about this again.

    So Unflinching is a nice idea on paper but having heavy armor for 5+ seconds in any game is insanely OP. A consideration to making it less OP would be to allow it only give you first hit armor (kinda like big band has when he does a right swipe) or maybe even two if the AI is that bad with it. This way you can still get a combo or at least not have to worry about being stuck because of it. In the case of Armed Forces it is near impossible to bypass unflinching as attempting a grab will almost always get countered into a full combo and in the case of Untouchable since it normally happens mid-combo you always get poked out of it into a combo.

    Either we reduce the amount of time Unflinching gets as a whole or reduce the power it has. As it stands losing over and over to this OP buff really kills any want to get better at this game.
     
    rexturtle1120 likes this.
  2. infine

    infine Active Member

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    I'm not sure about exact unflinching mechanics. For example if Drag'n'Bite triggers unflinching, say, on untouchable, she keeps flinching until the move finishes. even though it's multihit. So you kinda have time to cancel your combo into block. I believe the same happens with normal ground combo - unflinching AI gives you at least some time to stop. Of course if it activates after your 4th ground combo hit with the 5th already queued, you are almost always screwed, because L5 recovery will be too long, and you will be punished. So normally unflinching fighters just require you to pay attention to hit confirming which is already an issue with some Filia and Squiggly matchups without any unflinching involved.

    The problem is that some timings in ground combos are too tight to hitconfirm (Filia 3-4-5 or 3-4-Launcher for example - I often die in high streaks to delayed input because tired fingers. Even the slightest delay is enough for AI to counter-BB you). And while Untouchable is okayish, AF will punish you with diamond drop / diamonds are forever / excerbella with 100% certanity.

    I say unflinching characters are mostly beatable, but it's annoying, requires constant attention, and bad luck can royally screw you like with RE (yesterday I almost died to RE with Rusty in the front, since every first hit of a ground combo would trigger armour and every second would trigger stun. Consistently. Same happens with unflinching characters sometimes).

    Personally I would like to reduce unflinching time on AF because she has enough unflinching time to blockstring push you into a corner and you can do nothing about it because you can't grab her. Then she just chain-grabs you until you get enough meter for a BB to get out for a while or fail a tech and die.
     
  3. rexturtle1120

    rexturtle1120 Active Member

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    While I can see where your coming from, the fact is that Unfliching is an insanely helpful buff that can be taken advantage of on the field or on defense. Your asking the devs to lower a buff that seems to do its intended job perfectly, I mean you can lose to an enemy with invincible or final stand the only difference is that unflinching allows you to fight back. If unflinching is getting to be too out of hand there’s are some variants that can counter this for example the bronze peacock sketchy now brings enemy’s curse on tag in which is insanely helpful or doublishious who can steal buffs. You probably know all about those but the point is this is a feature designed to help players who are getting the smack down, it wouldnt be fair if just cause you kept losing to it that everyone with a defnse team that has it has to give it up. However though I do disagree on getting rid of unflinching I can agree that maybe Armed Forces Unfliching should be lessened, but she’s never really been a problem for me so eh.
     
    Zachary Baumstark and ALUni like this.
  4. Irghen

    Irghen Member

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    Grapplers > Unflinching

    To be honest I'm way more annoyed by 100% armor and the fact that I can't win by turtling.
     
  5. cappatacus

    cappatacus Active Member

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    I actually love this mechanic.

    (I know, hear me out.)

    It is so annoying to deal with Untouchable and Armed Forces, especially in high streaks. However, they aren't invincible. They're a fun challenge. Command grabs, aka half of Beowulf's move sets, easily counter Unflinching. Other command grabs include Diamond Drop or Daisy Pusher (or a BB3, obviously).

    You don't even need one of those to counter it, though. Throwing, and any combos produced by such, are a good way to counter, albeit with some risk. There are also launcher BBs, like Drag n Drop, Canopy Bounce, or Ms Fortune's Katana BB2. These will completely withstand Unflinching.

    It's not something that's impossible to beat, it's just something that has to be worked around. You're allowed to customize your teams to whichever defense team you choose - just take in a Beo or Doublicious or other prepared character into that match.

    I don't want to make this too long, so I'll write up a new thread with counters to Unflinching. But:

    Tl;Dr,
    Work around it
     
    Zachary Baumstark likes this.
  6. You cant beat D

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    There are ways to stop unflinching, actually a ton of them, but it can be annoying to be attacking someone, have them get unflinching, and then die before you can do anything
     
  7. Gylfie

    Gylfie Active Member

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    I personally think this isn’t a big problem, but I could be biased since I beat the treasure node with 2 AF in Parasoul origin story with a 4.9k Princess Pride. I’m not saying this for the purpose of bragging, I’m just saying it’s not that big of a problem. Use canopy bounce. Of course you’ll need to pray to the RNG gods, but there are a lot of counters to unflinching.
     
  8. Goatman302

    Goatman302 New Member

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    The problem I run into is the fact I'm low mid tier in the game where my fighters are just now breaking 5k in power. I know my teams aren't supposed to run that far with that little power, but the amount of ended runs from Unflinching is absurd (5 in a row to be exact). My team isn't in the position to properly counter Unflinching and is almost always a run killer. I'd be more then happy if the time of the debuff was reduced as that would fix how long I have to sit back and watch them gain meter for the BB to end my run and spend more time...well...fighting them. Unflinching just sends the whole fight into a stall. While I do have Beowulf on my team he is low level and weak and is unable to catch up quick enough to counter it. I end up relying on my Peacock to outspace them but in the case of AF and Untouchable they have many ways to bypass that.

    TL:DR - Reduce the time of Unflinching or at least give another way to counter it, as it stands its a kill-all-joy-run-ending buff.
     
  9. SSmashy

    SSmashy New Member

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    Like some people above said, unflinching is a powerful buff on both offense and defense. I can see how it's troublesome to deal with this buff especially with armed forces, untouchable and big top, however even early game, theres counter measures against it. For example its vulnerable to all types of grabs (normal/command) and vulnerable to any and all bb's. A decent way i found to combat it is getting any squigly to max skill tree and give her evil dead MA. A dead squigly nearby will inflict curse on hit which removes and negates buffs including unfliching. Personally I don't think this buff should be nerfed as without it most good defense teams wouldnt be nearly as strong(especially with the upcoming rift battles).
     
    Zachary Baumstark likes this.
  10. Irghen

    Irghen Member

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    I guess I only have a problem with it on Armed Forces given Bella's character ability since it dismisses Unflinching's vulnerability to grabs. So you either have insane damage, buff negation or a loss.
     
  11. Beldr447

    Beldr447 Active Member

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    Unflinching does not work against any BB, so the sec an enemy triggers it just use a BB.
     
  12. Starsmore

    Starsmore Active Member

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    The problem about Untouchable isn't unflinching, it's the 15% chances of avoid hits, it's ridicolus when she's able to avoid all the hits from a bb3 like Eliza's.
     

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