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How to deal with annoying defense

Does this guide helped you on how to deal with difficult defenders?

  • Heck yes

    Votes: 23 67.6%
  • Still need more stuff

    Votes: 11 32.4%

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Reshiram18

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Wouldn't Bloody Valentine be a good counter to Dread Locks as well? Usually I use her against that annoying goldy locks from some miserable part of Hell and her SAs are no problem at all. I just make sure to equip Eliza's regen taunt, get a max of special moves and it does the trick.
Main issue with Bloody Valentine is that she won't be the best option against DL in high streak PFs because her attack stat (base 8,640 as a level 60 invested diamond) is rather low. The low damage output from Bloody Valentine will increase the chance of timing the fight out if the rest of the team isn't strong enough to take out the other two fighters on the opposing team efficiently, and at that point it is just better to bring a Bloodbath, Heart of Darkness, or Tres Chic that can actually take out the DL efficiently. In lower streak PFs, some story fights, and some rift stuff Bloody Valentine is an acceptable option against DL but not the fastest option.
 
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Galiyuka

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Main issue with Bloody Valentine is that she won't be the best option against DL in high streak PFs because her attack stat (base 8,640 as a level 60 invested diamond) is rather low. The low damage output from Bloody Valentine will increase the chance of timing the fight out if the rest of the team isn't strong enough to take out the other two fighters on the opposing team efficiently, and at that point it is just better to bring a Bloodbath, Heart of Darkness, or Tres Chic that can actually take out the DL efficiently. In lower streak PFs, some story fights, and some rift stuff Bloody Valentine is an acceptable option against DL but not the fastest option.
Aaah, I suspected something like that. Thank you :)
 

fanghoul

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I think Persona's weakness is the Tagout special move, probably preferably with Sketchy in case you don't get her out front the first time. But if you kill her first then cycle through the rest they'll lose their barrier and blessing and should be a relative cinch to kill again.

If we allow diamonds, I've been learning the utility of Flytrap in the Robofortune prize fight. 5 stacks of Regen make up for a lot of issues with reflected damage.

Edit #2
There's also always Purrfect Dark. She's kinda the gold standard best character in the Robofortune prize fight.
 
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qlimax

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Great list and definitely helpful for many people.
I think you should add a precision chapter though. It is one of the more reliable ways to deal with something like plot twisted, immoral fiber or bluescreen. Fighters that spring to mind that have precision on command would be parasoul with taunt, Summer salt with her SA, Headhunter/Overclocked and Dragon Brawler.
Since most defensive fighters rely on their SA, not activating the SA through precision is one of best things to do since there is little the enemy can do to prevent you getting precision.
 
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Art3mes

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Another one:
Splitting Image 1stMA (24k)
Heavily invested

You can use any character (try to avoid diamonds) but max allowed score of 14k.
And you can't use Hex.
 
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fanghoul

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I mean, the hilarious way to beat her would be a somewhat damaged Terror Byte, starting the fight, getting Inverse Polarity in before the Immunity popped, then tagging in Claw & Order to keep renewing it while she kills herself with healing.

A somewhat damaged Filia with her MA might be able to just negate the healing by stacking some bleeds before the immunity popped up.

I'd have to test it, but I wonder if being cursed would prevent the Immunity from ever spawning? Because it's super easy to trigger her MA, and if you even had Sketchy to curse her, that might prevent the immunity which is the major hitch in my mind to beating her then.
 
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Art3mes

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I mean, the hilarious way to beat her would be a somewhat damaged Terror Byte, starting the fight, getting Inverse Polarity in before the Immunity popped, then tagging in Claw & Order to keep renewing it while she kills herself with healing.

A somewhat damaged Filia with her MA might be able to just negate the healing by stacking some bleeds before the immunity popped up.

I'd have to test it, but I wonder if being cursed would prevent the Immunity from ever spawning? Because it's super easy to trigger her MA, and if you even had Sketchy to curse her, that might prevent the immunity which is the major hitch in my mind to beating her then.
They rarely shows up in prize fights so there are less chances to try different counter strategies.
I'll try the terror + claw strategy the next times she shows up.
Thanks for the reply though.
 

fanghoul

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They rarely shows up in prize fights so there are less chances to try different counter strategies.
I'll try the terror + claw strategy the next times she shows up.
Thanks for the reply though.

Sundae School might help you keep the debuff up by making it last longer.

I'll see if I can't think of any more strategies and maybe find someone with her to experiment against using the duel function. But being willing to take some damage first to avoid the immunity and healing seems promising if risky.
 
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Hall☆weenQueen

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Another one:
Splitting Image 1stMA (24k)
Heavily invested

You can use any character (try to avoid diamonds) but max allowed score of 14k.
And you can't use Hex.
Actually bio can help keep her from healing and if she BBs you just revive! But other than brute force I haven't found a good strategy to defeat her. If I remember correctly her immunity is permanent so the usual buff removers won't do it. Like bio, summer salt may also do the trick too. Or a miasma gaining Fukua like Vaporwave. I've fought her a few times in Pea Master but like I said brute force or bio is usually how I handle her but I hope you can find a way that works!
 
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fanghoul

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They rarely shows up in prize fights so there are less chances to try different counter strategies.
I'll try the terror + claw strategy the next times she shows up.
Thanks for the reply though.

I actually have a Splitting Image I've been heavily investing in now, so I can give some more advice about how here SA1 works.

1) The immunity flips on and off. I guess this would be harder to notice when she's on defense and constantly getting pounded, but any time she has more life than her opponent her immunity immediately goes away, as does the regeneration. Which is good news in terms of not needing to get things right the first time you try to block her immunity.

2) It's hard to get cursed at the right time playing her on offense, but when I have been it does seem to **** with her SA1 royally. If her immunity doesn't proc when it's supposed to, getting it to later is tricky. I'm not entirely certain what causes it to proc and not proc at that point, but it doesn't just come up as soon as curse ends even if I'm then at lower life. I don't believe the immunity procs even if someone else tags in. So having less life than her, cursing her and then taking her down with debuffs does appear to be an option, even if you don't sustain the curse debuff. Could use further testing, but I need to figure out a safe and consistent way to get cursed.

(Now there's a sentence to write down in a journal somewhere.)

Anyway, hope that helps, what with the Fukua prize fight being back!
 

Art3mes

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I actually have a Splitting Image I've been heavily investing in now, so I can give some more advice about how here SA1 works.

1) The immunity flips on and off. I guess this would be harder to notice when she's on defense and constantly getting pounded, but any time she has more life than her opponent her immunity immediately goes away, as does the regeneration. Which is good news in terms of not needing to get things right the first time you try to block her immunity.

2) It's hard to get cursed at the right time playing her on offense, but when I have been it does seem to **** with her SA1 royally. If her immunity doesn't proc when it's supposed to, getting it to later is tricky. I'm not entirely certain what causes it to proc and not proc at that point, but it doesn't just come up as soon as curse ends even if I'm then at lower life. I don't believe the immunity procs even if someone else tags in. So having less life than her, cursing her and then taking her down with debuffs does appear to be an option, even if you don't sustain the curse debuff. Could use further testing, but I need to figure out a safe and consistent way to get cursed.

(Now there's a sentence to write down in a journal somewhere.)

Anyway, hope that helps, what with the Fukua prize fight being back!
Thanks for the info, bud.
I found two in Fukua pf, Xeno cheesed them.
Xeno feels safe as even if she dies, 3 stacks of bleed works.
 
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fanghoul

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Thanks for the info, bud.
I found two in Fukua pf, Xeno cheesed them.
Xeno feels safe as even if she dies, 3 stacks of bleed works.

This is a great insight since there's really no way for Xeno to have more life and be dead at the same time!
 
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Art3mes

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What is the best way to deal with marqueed Painwheels? I mean the stacks of armor is a nuisance and to receive 100% crit damage back is much more of a headache.
Conditions:
No buff dealers. This will include every famous variants like the chewing gum, that silver black cat, the yellow top Parasol, rust, etc.
You can't regain your health back. So no regen and no Dio.
 

Yomady

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Should list the three Squigly - Dead of Winter's as I found a ok'ish team.
Tested Valentine - General Surgeon (I do against anything that looks strong) and lost flat out, but a bleed character like Painwheel - Freaky Friday could work it right on those 'my life' deals.

“When life gives you lemons, use Painwheel to cut lemon and make lemonade”
 

fanghoul

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What is the best way to deal with marqueed Painwheels? I mean the stacks of armor is a nuisance and to receive 100% crit damage back is much more of a headache.
Conditions:
No buff dealers. This will include every famous variants like the chewing gum, that silver black cat, the yellow top Parasol, rust, etc.
You can't regain your health back. So no regen and no Dio.

Well, there's two obvious ways to avoid crit reflect damage. The first is that throws can't crit. So Cerebella and Beowulf are your pals here.

The other option, which I use more than I like to admit, is just investing in everything for some characters except their +crit% chance on their tree when you're filling it up, unless you're planning to Marquee them. It's a cheesey thing to do, but there's more than one terrible SA, MA, etc. that can be avoided by doing this.

Honestly the #1 worst thing about the reflected crit damage MA in some ways is the surprise, because so few people go that way and you're rarely prepared for it.
 
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Art3mes

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Well, there's two obvious ways to avoid crit reflect damage. The first is that throws can't crit. So Cerebella and Beowulf are your pals here.

The other option, which I use more than I like to admit, is just investing in everything for some characters except their +crit% chance on their tree when you're filling it up, unless you're planning to Marquee them. It's a cheesey thing to do, but there's more than one terrible SA, MA, etc. that can be avoided by doing this.

Honestly the #1 worst thing about the reflected crit damage MA in some ways is the surprise, because so few people go that way and you're rarely prepared for it.
Seems good. But all my characters are equipped with more than 40% crit rate. A new set of moves? I'll give it a shot.
Also throws will only kill the opponent if you are having same or greater fighter score than them. Isn't there some reliable strategy?
(^ 〰 ^)
 
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Dusty00

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Seems good. But all my characters are equipped with more than 40% crit rate. A new set of moves? I'll give it a shot.
Also throws will only kill the opponent if you are having same or greater fighter score than them. Isn't there some reliable strategy?
(^ 〰 ^)
Bio is the most common solution - curse on grudge and drain life back on tainted. Divine Intervention also works quite well if you can apply curse consistently via burst and ace. She also heals back in sekhmet mode to counter tainted.

Sketchy curse is also often used for grudge. For tainted, Filias and Fukuas can also gain life back via leech and snuggle. Maybe Annie can heal back enough too. The tricky part with Bella and Beo throws is DPtB will reflect their heavy hits, but that’s only in rift.
 

fanghoul

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Seems good. But all my characters are equipped with more than 40% crit rate. A new set of moves? I'll give it a shot.
Also throws will only kill the opponent if you are having same or greater fighter score than them. Isn't there some reliable strategy?
(^ 〰 ^)

Well, a lot of moves also count as throws, both blockbusters and special moves. I'm not sure why you'd need a greater fight score. Poultergust with Daily Pusher or her BB3 can make huge dents without damaging herself. Toad Warrior is another option with Diamond Drop, her BB3s, and Excellebella. Or use Harlequin and Pummel Horse and Merry-go-rilla.

I mean, if you don't invest in +crit% moves, even reflecting 100% of your crit damage, she's only going to reflect around 20% of her total life bar. There are cases where it's really bad, but it shouldn't generally be too bad, especially with a little planning?
 
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Yomady

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Seems good. But all my characters are equipped with more than 40% crit rate. A new set of moves? I'll give it a shot.
Also throws will only kill the opponent if you are having same or greater fighter score than them. Isn't there some reliable strategy?
(^ 〰 ^)
Jab, bleed, then run lol
 

Art3mes

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Bio is the most common solution - curse on grudge and drain life back on tainted. Divine Intervention also works quite well if you can apply curse consistently via burst and ace. She also heals back in sekhmet mode to counter tainted.

Sketchy curse is also often used for grudge. For tainted, Filias and Fukuas can also gain life back via leech and snuggle. Maybe Annie can heal back enough too. The tricky part with Bella and Beo throws is DPtB will reflect their heavy hits, but that’s only in rift.
Nice strategies. I'll keep these in mind. Thanks.